[QUOTE=Gill2003;191953]Im just not a big fan of the GM/Ford idea of making cars. Example Ford, they have ford fusion and mercury something or another. Now I wont pay top dollar for a supposedly luxury car, that can be mistaken for an entry level sedan. Sam goes with GM. Its like 1 car, but as a pontiac it supposed to be performance, and as buick its supposed to be luxury, and chevy… well is chevy.
Newer japanese and german cars have followed this trend to a degree.[/QUOTE]
Yes, they need to stop marketing these cars under 7 different flags sperated only by trim levels. The Japanese have gotten away from it too, though there still are some relics in the vein of the mazda-ford developmental relationship.
My biggest problem with amercian cars is that they are geared towards exterior styling and big HP at the cost of interior refinement and reliability. Besides a 16 year old, who cares more about what the outside of the car looks like and how loud it is than they do about how it rides/drives and how reliable it is? It’s shallow marketing over substance. I understand that their costs are higher, but they are protected in the U.S. by tariffs - enough that if they focused on building reliable cars that were fun to drive, they’d do just fine. People want to buy American brands, although that is dying off after decades of blind loyalty.
Along those lines -> Ford kills off more enthusiasm for their cars with cheap plastics than any other car company in the world.
Exactly NA. Their cars are shallow. Like a crappy book with a pretty cover. Also, if you noticed, their cars are designed to look good today, but 5 years down the road… butt ugly…
I love the way older imports look. Most of them (Some nissans and toyotas) still look good today. Where as, I hate the look of the of the most recent sunfires or most recent cavaliers. and in 5 more years… they will look really hideous.
Stock LS1 Z (with typical flowmaster) pulls only 275HP on a dyno, but torque 290. 290! Thats more then more pick up trucks! But I am kinda hestitant about that 275, only because I got it off a enthusiast site. It could be biased.
Is your car stock?[/QUOTE]
I know my 2000 SS was puttin down around 318 to the wheels when it was still bone stock, and that should only be slightly higher than the Z28. Still…the SS’s were only RATED around 320BHP that year, and the Z28’s were rated @ 305.
Pontiacs: the ugliest cars on the road bar none. Maybe this newest generation has some fine looking rides, but anything before is just hiseous.
The reason you havn’t liked Sunfires, Gill, is because they are ugly.
I think the recent gen Comaro is just as bad the recent gen Firebirds… hideous. (Sorry, ChevEE) The brand new Comaros, however, look sweet! Bringin back the old school look is a good idea.
Mercury cars usually look pretty bad to me as well. That minor difference between Ford and Mercury makes a world of dif to me. Most of the Fords Im ok with, but the exact same car with a Mercury tinge to it makes me sick.
Even the Ford Mustang I’m sick of now. They are like Wal-Mart cars. I see them everywhere and tons of people who own them don’t take care of them at all so they look awful now. Or they have retarded stickers on them and look like crap when they come off the line. Some Mustangs, look sick tho, but probably 1/2 - 3/4 look like crap. The new mustangs don’t look too good to me as well. There are a few I like but not many.
American car makers really need to get a new exterior design staff IMO. Get some people from Acura!
I dont know about ur rant on camaro’s. That is an iconic car. The look, its what makes it a Camaro. Rip on the Cavalier, the SSR the wierd looking retro box thing…
But the Camaro… I dunno.
Mustang though… I gotta agree. This new one, they finally did something right, made something a little more unique. It actually lives up to its name.
I dont know about ur rant on camaro's. That is an iconic car. The look, its what makes it a Camaro. Rip on the Cavalier, the SSR the wierd looking retro box thing...
But the Camaro… I dunno.
Mustang though… I gotta agree. This new one, they finally did something right, made something a little more unique. It actually lives up to its name.
I had a BMW Z3 and that car was seriously sweet. Very refined and a blast to drive. I have 72 MGB that runs when it feels like it. Once I got into motorcycles my car fetish took a nose dive. I sold the BMW and now drive an Explorer just to get me around.
n Arlington, GM pays union-scale wages of $26.50 to $30.50 an hour to its 2,800 hourly workers there. On average, GM pays $81.18 an hour in wages and benefits to U.S. hourly workers, including pension and retiree medical costs.
At that rate, labor costs per vehicle at Arlington are about $1,800, based on the Harbour Consulting estimate of labor hours per vehicle.
n San Antonio, Toyota will use nonunion labor and will start its 1,600 hourly workers at $15.50 to $20.33 per hour, which will grow after three years to $21 to $25.
Harbour Consulting President Ron Harbour estimates Toyota’s total hourly U.S. labor costs, with benefits, at about $35 an hour. The brand-new plant won’t have any direct retiree costs foryears.
thats amazing
it goes into detail in how Toyota is whooping GM, they just opened a plant in the heart of Texas to build Toyota Tundra’s(American Jobs obviously) where American Trucks are the norm…on a side note, Nissan is looking at NC for a plant right now if State pays them off good enough…anyone here work for the BMW plant in Spartanburg by chance? NC missed out on that one.
eventually Toyota will buy the bits and pieces of GM/Ford that get auctioned off after they go bankrupt, Ford’s Bonds are already rated ‘Junk’…its ashame. on the other hand GM’s stock is up like 70% so far this year so maybe there is hope.
That is so a rant. But call it what you want. Long sleek big engine mean. Thats what a Camaro has always been.
Dont get me wrong, Im not big on the looks either, but a Camaro is what it is and I cant say its ugly because it doesnt look like my dub
It wasn’t a rant. Look up the def. I was neither noisy, excited, vehement, nor bombastic.
As far as the car goes, every model has kicked ass until you get to this design. But those past models mean bubkiss when talking about this model’s design. It is too long, too round, and too much like a wedge. It looks like a freakin door stop with a passenger compartment. Again, I am not talking about what the car stands for and how well this body style represents that. I am simply explaining why I think this model is bad.
ah… real speed… real man and machine connect… this is beautiful
I used to have this, but I sold it to buy a Jeep Wrangler. Meanest sum of a stitch out there, cammed with the DD exhaust… it was loud and mean. and Fast, topped out 140 on I-40 (ha ha)
It wasn't a rant. Look up the def. I was neither noisy, excited, vehement, nor bombastic.
As far as the car goes, every model has kicked ass until you get to this design. But those past models mean bubkiss when talking about this model’s design. It is too long, too round, and too much like a wedge. It looks like a freakin door stop with a passenger compartment. Again, I am not talking about what the car stands for and how well this body style represents that. I am simply explaining why I think this model is bad.
I sold the BMW and now drive an Explorer just to get me around.
I used to use an Explorer to get around but now I use Mozilla Firefox.:lol:
(Corny… I know, but I’m a computer scientist so what can you expect.)
Most BMWs look great to me, but there is one I detest. The Z4 I beleive? I’m not good with BMW names but I think it is this car. This looks like it but it looks even worse when I see it driving around. http://www.autogazeta.com/g/382/bmw_z4.jpg
Im not too excited about its nose, hoever the coupe version is HOT
I do believe the Z series is only a coupe series so there are no other versions, Mrs. Hilton. As for the car, I think it looks like a little rat scurrying around, especially with that nose.
btw.. ha ha on that joke.. It took a few seconds.. but hilarious!
I’m gonna be needing to buy a car towards the end of this year. The only american made care I’m even possibly considering is the Pontiac Solstice, and thats only cause its the sweetest lookin car i’ve seen in a loooong time (although I hear there is some issues with visibility, and the ease of putting the top up/down). its too bad GM let saturn basically copy/modify the style to produce the Sky. bad decision That said, I’ll probably end up getting an accord or altima.
[QUOTE=49or bust;191992]
Most BMWs look great to me, but there is one I detest. The Z4 I beleive? I’m not good with BMW names but I think it is this car. This looks like it but it looks even worse when I see it driving around. http://www.autogazeta.com/g/382/bmw_z4.jpg[/QUOTE]
Yeah BMW’s new design chief, his name escapes me, came in a few years ago and has slowly destroyed that entire product line. First it was the 7 series, then the 5 and now the 3. They took the z3 (The Bond convertible) and totally destroyed it with the z4. The interior is awful too. They tried this Idrive thing where you control most of the controls in the car with one button/dial. Just horrible IMO. I actually asked a BMW salesman and he said that most of the z3 owners hated the z4.
I have a a soft spot for little convertibles. I had a Miata before the z3. Once my Harley is paid off I am going to either pick up one of the new Miatas or the old M Roadster from BMW.
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That said, I’ll probably end up getting an accord or altima.
