GM Sets the price on the Volt. Nissan Leaf price also known

I can get on board with converting fleet vehicles and semi-trucks to NG. They represent a small fraction of the actual vehicles on the road, but a relatively large percentage of total fuel consumption. There should not be a massive change-over for the general consumer though.

The U.S. does have large NG deposits, but just how large is up for debate. The Oil/Gas companies have put the hype machine at full capacity so the U.S. would open more public lands for drilling, but independent reviews of many of their claims have shown that the actual amount is significantly overstated.

This article gives a pretty good breakdown of gas company claims:
http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/future_tense/2011/12/is_there_really_100_years_worth_of_natural_gas_beneath_the_united_states_.html

http://news.yahoo.com/power-shortages-loom-idled-calif-nuke-plant-001159278.html

No matter the resource there are always challenges.

Bob Lutz is not going to take attacks on the electric car lying down – the closest he’ll come to that is doing push-ups on The Colbert Report. After spending a few of his Forbes columns laying into right-wing pundits for their attacks on the Chevrolet Volt, he is switching to a positive message about how plug-in cars can help with American national security. It is not surprising that Lutz, a former Marine, co-authors the article with two former U.S. Marines commandants and the CEO of FedEx (the three are all members of Securing America’s Future Energy’s (SAFE) Energy Security Leadership Council). The gist? Well, here’s part of the opening paragraph:

When … threats exist because the United States is the protector of the world’s global oil supply lines, it is a clear illustration of how our nation’s over-reliance on a single, globally priced fuel impacts our national and economic security.

America’s addiction to gasoline costs the government billions of dollars a year, an estimated $80 billion, in fact, to guard the sea lanes, including one little area by Iran:

From a national security perspective, the U.S. military is forced to protect the world’s vital oil infrastructure. The single greatest chokepoint is the Strait of Hormuz, through which 17 million barrels of oil per day passed in 2011 – 20 percent of global supplies. Protection of the sea lanes of commerce has become an American burden and will remain so, costing the United States Treasury an estimated $80 billion per year while taxing our military, which is already engaged on multiple fronts.

It’s arguments like this that have made the recent right-wing criticism of the Volt such a mystery. If we use less gasoline, we can spend fewer lives and less treasure importing the fuel (of course, we don’t lose many lives at the Canadian border, which is where most of our imported oil comes from). The Army says that today’s soldier uses an average of 22 gallons of gasoline a day.

Lutz and his co-authors are quite clear that high gas prices are hurting Americans’ pocketbooks, “essentially” wiping out tax cuts that Presidents Bush and Obama put into place. That’s why, they say, “government action is needed to mitigate the risks of oil dependence, because there is no free market for oil.” This intervention contains both expanded domestic production and – surprise – plugging in our light-duty transportation fleet as much as possible and feeding our big trucks lots of natural gas. To that end, they write:

Regarding electrification, the beauty of plug-in hybrids and pure electric vehicles like the Chevy Volt and the Nissan Leaf is that they are powered by electricity, which can be generated from many sources: nuclear, coal, natural gas, and renewables. Best yet, these are all domestic energy sources, meaning OPEC won’t be able to corner the market. And the retail price of electricity is far less volatile that the price of oil.

Hard to disagree with that. There’s more at Forbes.

That’s just hippie talk.

Like I said earlier - I am all for electric vehicles as long as our grid can handle it, while we continue to make more efficient vehicles. I also think we need to continue to use all of our own resources and that includes oil. I just don’t think electric cars are a cure all at this time. Drill baby drill isn’t a solution either, but drilling while we continue to develop and refine alternatives seems like the best way. It is too bad lobbyists and special interests on each side are dictating what happens.

For me personally when an electric car, for the price (initial and maint) of a petro car can give me the performance of of a sports sedan in terms of handling and acceleration then I am on board. Until then I am not interested and when averaged with my motorcycle driving I am still getting 40+ mpg right now.

That obviously doesn’t include the Normbulance ;D

My issue with the Volt has always been it’s position as a halo car and that the government justified it’s involvement with the company at least partially based on that car. I have no issue with the Leaf - just wouldn’t buy one myself.

It shouldn’t significantly impact the grid. There is significant excess capacity at night when most charging would occur.

Electric motors already give better acceleration and smoother handling than petroleum engines.

The Volt has a tiny engine in it and does 0-60 in 8 seconds. That’s pretty solid.

The Tesla sedan that is coming out later this year will go 0-60 in 5.6 seconds. That’s faster than most sport sedans that you can get for $50,000. It will cost $3.92 to “fill up” for a Duke Energy customer if you have the 40kWh battery option, double that if you go for the battery option that will go 300 miles. That comes out to 2 cents per mile for fuel! That’s unbelievable. They will also be able to fully recharge in an hour. If you need a quarter of a ‘tank’ it will take 15 minutes. That’s not unreasonable at all IMO.

The Tesla batteries are a step up from the batteries used in the Prius, so that means they’ll be good for at least 200,000 miles.

The Tesla S will set the precedent for future electrics that have long range, quick recharge times, and prices that are affordable for your average drivers.

[quote=“Niner National, post:86, topic:23642”]It shouldn’t significantly impact the grid. There is significant excess capacity at night when most charging would occur.

Electric motors already give better acceleration and smoother handling than petroleum engines.

The Volt has a tiny engine in it and does 0-60 in 8 seconds. That’s pretty solid.

The Tesla sedan that is coming out later this year will go 0-60 in 5.6 seconds. That’s faster than most sport sedans that you can get for $50,000. It will cost $3.92 to “fill up” for a Duke Energy customer if you have the 40kWh battery option, double that if you go for the battery option that will go 300 miles. That comes out to 2 cents per mile for fuel! That’s unbelievable. They will also be able to fully recharge in an hour. If you need a quarter of a ‘tank’ it will take 15 minutes. That’s not unreasonable at all IMO.

The Tesla batteries are a step up from the batteries used in the Prius, so that means they’ll be good for at least 200,000 miles.

The Tesla S will set the precedent for future electrics that have long range, quick recharge times, and prices that are affordable for your average drivers.[/quote]

Yes the Tesla is what I have in mind both in terms of looks and performance. Just need more of them and to get their price down. Really I am talking Tesla-esque performance at a Prius price.

What Prius are you talking about? Everything I have seen is high 9s and the handling isn’t great.

As for grid - there are areas of our country that are already in trouble and if everyone switched over and started charging a car at night I am not sure we are prepared for that even given some of the availability. In addition to that we need to make sure our government is prepared to make the fuels needed to power those plants available and the construction of new plants easier.

There is a good chance the next motorcycle I buy will be an electric one that is coming out. I have been waiting on it for a few years while they fixed a few things.

http://www.brammo.com/empulse/

Not talking about a Prius. I was talking about the Volt with the 8 second zero to 60.

The only mention I had of the Prius was about the batteries. My girlfriend’s Prius has 156,000 miles on it and it still will get 60+ mpg in traffic (they do better in traffic than on the open highway). There are a lot out there with 200,000+ miles on them.

Also, keep in mind the Prius is a hybrid that runs on a gasoline engine 99% of the time. It is not the same as an electric vehicle.

[quote=“Niner National, post:86, topic:23642”]It shouldn’t significantly impact the grid. There is significant excess capacity at night when most charging would occur.

Electric motors already give better acceleration and smoother handling than petroleum engines.

The Volt has a tiny engine in it and does 0-60 in 8 seconds. That’s pretty solid.

The Tesla sedan that is coming out later this year will go 0-60 in 5.6 seconds. That’s faster than most sport sedans that you can get for $50,000. It will cost $3.92 to “fill up” for a Duke Energy customer if you have the 40kWh battery option, double that if you go for the battery option that will go 300 miles. That comes out to 2 cents per mile for fuel! That’s unbelievable. They will also be able to fully recharge in an hour. If you need a quarter of a ‘tank’ it will take 15 minutes. That’s not unreasonable at all IMO.

The Tesla batteries are a step up from the batteries used in the Prius, so that means they’ll be good for at least 200,000 miles.

The Tesla S will set the precedent for future electrics that have long range, quick recharge times, and prices that are affordable for your average drivers.[/quote]

Based on 110 or 220 V outlet?

Not sure, but I imagine that will be with a special charger you will have to buy separately. That’s what the Leaf and Volt did for owners who wanted quicker charge times.