PI, if you donât find the topic interesting, itâs ok not to post.
My main point was that USF can be in the BCS, observing the direction of 2 comparable athletic programs. I for one was floored when I heard that the BCS is a possibility for them.
I agree that talking about football can come across as #####ing but I also would like to see it in my lifetime. Iâm not sure whatâs wrong with that.
[FONT=Arial][SIZE=2]Like ditch diggers, the world needs computer geeks and bean counters too. So I am greatful that pi has worked so hard at figuring out how football wonât work.
But, Norman makes a good point. A football program, with additional scholarships, would be a blip on the overall school operating budget. How does the school build a parking deck when it wants one? It adds a fee to their tuition costs. How does UNCCâs tuition compare to private colleges or northern schools? Plenty of room there.
A football fee could be voted on by the studentsâjust an idea to help with start-up and operating costs. Year 1=$50/semester, Y2=75, Y3=100, Y4=125, Y5=150â>yielding well over $20 million in 5 years. We are projected to have 25000 students in 5 yearsâŚI would have voted for it as a student.
Donations are out there. Nowhere do donate at present. For example, the Harris Alumni Center started with a $1million donation from Harris
Money in budget? Just chucked out $40 mill for an uptown campus, when the main campus is only 10 minutes away
$3mill for a place for the chancellor to sleep part time and entertain.
[QUOTE=JaMiNNiNeR;140391]For goodness sake, it seems as if every time someone gets on here and says anything about football like two or three people jump on here and write a dam dissertation on how we canât have it or why it wonât work.[/QUOTE]
Itâs because most of the new people who post about football know nothing about how it would be funded or how the university budget works. They simply say âI want football for Charlotte nowâ and expect a stadium and the team to pop up on Mallard Creek Road like a jack-in-the-box. Several have taken the time to try to educate them on why we do not have football and what we need to do to go about getting it so that theyâll hopefully better understand our situation. You mentioned that companies make investments all the time without the current funds, but they do so knowing that there is a high percentage chance that the investment will bring a positive return. Show me a company that makes huge investments on a 30% chance that the investment will make a positive return, and Iâll show you most of those same companies filing for Chapter 13 the next year.
[QUOTE]A football fee could be voted on by the studentsâjust an idea to help with start-up and operating costs. Year 1=$50/semester, Y2=75, Y3=100, Y4=125, Y5=150â>yielding well over $20 million in 5 years. We are projected to have 25000 students in 5 yearsâŚI would have voted for it as a student.
Donations are out there. Nowhere do donate at present. For example, the Harris Alumni Center started with a $1million donation from Harris
Money in budget? Just chucked out $40 mill for an uptown campus, when the main campus is only 10 minutes away
$3mill for a place for the chancellor to sleep part time and entertain.[/QUOTE]
The students have been nickle-dimed to death lately, and adding to their fees is not going to make the people paying the tuition bills happy. $20-$50 might be okay, but make it higher than that and the backlash will be strong.
Where are those donations totaling $1 mill? The monies donated to the Alumni Center were from a private party(s) who [B]CHOSE[/B] for the money to go to building the house. You canât take money allocated for other things and simply put it towards football. Budgets donât work like that in general, and the primary purpose of college is college, not football. The money is going to have to primarily come from outside benefactors to get the program started. Nobody with deep pockets has pledged a big amount yet. When they do, we might get the ball rolling.
[QUOTE=JaMiNNiNeR;140393]Who knows if Charlotte would support football? Our basketball teams have a pretty good following and usually ranks as one of the better programs in the nation. Other schools in our region seem to support football like ECU, App St., Coastal Carolina, South Carolina, Clemson, and NC State and most of them arenât even that good. I mean the university is only in the largest city in the state of North Carolina and will soon have a student population of 25,000+. I personally feel our school could support football but obviously most of the school administration doesnât think we can because they wonât even make the effort to study the idea.[/QUOTE]
This is one of the worsts posts Iâve ever seen on this topic.
1st - Support for our basketball team is AVERAGE at best. That is the crux of the argument. We canât sell out a 9K seat arena for a GOOD D1 B-Ball program. If we donât have support for B-Ball what makes you think we will support Football (which requires 10X the money & support of B-Ball)?
2nd- What you âpersonally feelâ is not enough to make an administration dive into a risky $10million+ venture. Again, feelings & assumptions donât make things happenâŚHARD DATA does.
No one has still yet to provide HARD DATA proving that Football would work. Why? Because it doesnât exist.
All of the HARD DATA that is available proves that it WON"T work. Hard data includes: The minimal amount of yearly 49er Athletic Fund Donations, apathetic 49er support of current programs, lack of sufficient funding of current programs, etcâŚHARD DATA is REAL dataâŚnot ASSUMPTIONS. The real data CLEARY shows our issues.
[FONT=Arial][SIZE=2]The fees are potentially a great idea. You graduate the fees so that it has a minimum impact on current students and future students make there UNCC their choice knowing that the fees are part of it. The fees help with the start up costs and eventually counter the annual cost. Any revenues can go back to offset the following yearâs fees. The students should be able to vote on if they want the fees. I have to believe that most students would be for it. UNCC tuition is pretty damn affordable. Hell, how much does it cost to park there now? I donât see too many empty parking lots when I drive through campus.
[COLOR=red]âWhere are those donations totaling $1 mill? The monies donated to the Alumni Center were from a private party(s) who [B]CHOSE[/B] for the money to go to building the house. You canât take money allocated for other things and simply put it towards football.ââ[/COLOR]
You misunderstood the comment. Didnât say to steal that money. You guys keep asking where are the donations? The Alumni Center is a cause that got $1mil from one party. Not too shabby. Where can people donate monies to a football program, sounds like you know it all?
[COLOR=red]âYou canât take money allocated for other things and simply put it towards football. Budgets donât work like that in general, and the primary purpose of college is college, not football. The money is going to have to primarily come from outside benefactors to get the program started. Nobody with deep pockets has pledged a big amount yet. When they do, we might get the ball rolling.â[/COLOR]
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[COLOR=black]DisagreeâŚA football program can only get rolling if the students get proactive. Business and private donors will follow. Again, right now, where is someone supposed to donate for a future football program? The current and past ADMIN is against it. [/COLOR]
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[COLOR=black]As for the budget, YEAR 2006-07 UNCC annual budget was $2,170,486,009 dollars. With previous research showing that the annual cost for a football program being about $7million (even with additional staff and womens programs), the annual cost of a football program is about .003% of the total annual budget. [/COLOR]
If sports arenât part of the college experience, why the hell do we have basketball, or baseball? How much recognition would we get if we only had the debate club to sport?
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Not trying to argue, just a question. Would it help if we did what the Panthers did and sell season tickets before the team even had their first season. That way we would have the money up front and have a solid fan base before the first game. It would also show that we are in it for the long hall which would attrack corporate sponsors. Just a thought.
EE, That is I think all that the PRO football crowd is asking for. Give us a shot. If it fails it fails. The main disagreement I think is the pro-football crowd (me included) want the school leadership to say yes we are going to make football happen. The other side, notice I didnât say anti, think the money needs to be there before any formal annoucement is made by the school. It is like the chicken and the egg debate. I donât think we will ever agree.
You misunderstood the comment. Didnât say to steal that money. You guys keep asking where are the donations? The Alumni Center is a cause that got $1mil from one party. Not too shabby. Where can people donate monies to a football program, sounds like you know it all?[/QUOTE]
Thanks for the backhanded compliment. Call the 49er Athletic Foundation at the number in my signature and state that you would like to write a check for the start-up costs for football. Better yet, write the check and send it to them with a letter stating what it is for. When you elect not to do this, then quit expecting someone else to help fund the program if youâre not willing to help fund it.
[QUOTE][COLOR=black]DisagreeâŚA football program can only get rolling if the students get proactive. Business and private donors will follow. Again, right now, where is someone supposed to donate for a future football program? The current and past ADMIN is against it. [/COLOR][/QUOTE]
Hereâs where I really think youâre wrong. See how far the football program gets with the students paying for it. Youâll still be hoping for football 50 years from now. Students donât have deep pockets. Their parents might, but the students do not. Their attendance is a must for future success, but the students will only play a small part in offsetting the start-up costs, and thatâs only if student fees are raised to do so.
[QUOTE][COLOR=black]As for the budget, YEAR 2006-07 UNCC annual budget was $2,170,486,009 dollars. With previous research showing that the annual cost for a football program being about $7million (even with additional staff and womens programs), the annual cost of a football program is about .003% of the total annual budget. [/COLOR] [/QUOTE]
Most of that money comes from tuition and state funding, none of which can go towards starting a football program. The operating budgets of every other sport are a fraction of what football is. Mensâ basketball pays for itself and for much of the other sports that we field teams for. Football is a money loser, and you would have to add several other womenâs sports to go with it to satisfy Title IX. This would further add to the start-up costs.
Calling the AD and giving them a check for a football team that does not exist, has no time table to exist and has no school leadership backing itâs existance is just about the dumbest thing I hear when talking about football here. NO fundraising campaign operates that way. You can not expect people to donate until you establish that
1- It is a reality at some point⌠even if it is 20 years away.
2- Establish an account to demonstrate to the football backers that their funds are indeed being held for football.
3- Periodic reporting updating ALL givers of the status of football.
Once this is established ALL sides will be happy. I have a place to send money and know what it will be used for. The other side gets to monitor funds status and know when we can afford it. Any major givers will know we are serious and corporate giving can also take place.
[QUOTE=WBNiner;140579]Calling the AD and giving them a check for a football team that does not exist, has no time table to exist and has no school leadership backing itâs existance is just about the dumbest thing I hear when talking about football here.
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Whoâs to say that they will not keep the money for football? Has anybody asked and been told ânoâ?
[QUOTE]NO fundraising campaign operates that way. You can not expect people to donate until you establish that [/QUOTE]
And you do not begin a fundraising campaign knowing ahead of time that you will not raise the money that you need to befin what it is you are fundraising for. Until you have several big donors in line, itâs not going to happen.
You are WAY off! My church recently had/has a campaign for a new building. It has levels that we need to hit to move forward. Knowing that it may take 10 years to achieve the level we need.
You have NO idea if we could achieve the giving we need or not. If we have a 10 year campaign, with a goal we very well could achieve what we need.
Why would a major donor (private or corporate) give money when the school wonât back it?
[QUOTE=WBNiner;140586]You are WAY off! My church recently had/has a campaign for a new building. It has levels that we need to hit to move forward. Knowing that it may take 10 years to achieve the level we need. [/QUOTE]
Therein lies the second argument to having football. Your church, I am assuming, needed this building to support its growth. We donât NEED football to prosper growth on campus or for what little revenue it might generate. I WANT football. Most Niner fans WANT football. But we donât NEED football.
[QUOTE]You have NO idea if we could achieve the giving we need or not. If we have a 10 year campaign, with a goal we very well could achieve what we need. [/QUOTE]
I beg to differ. If we set a goal of having football by 2050, I would bet that we could raise the money by then. Setting a timetable for reaching the goal is part of the fundraising process. Anybody can set them. As I said, we could probably meet 2050. Until we believe we can reach our goal within 5 years or so, no funds or fundraising will be done. Again, as HP has stated OVER and OVER again, we arenât even funding the current scholarships. Until we do that each year, football will continue to be a backburner issue.
[QUOTE]Why would a major donor (private or corporate) give money when the school wonât back it?[/QUOTE]
If B of A or Wachovia or Belk informed Judy or Dr. Dubois that they were prepared to donate X million for us to start football, donât you think we would get the ball rolling? Do you really think that they would turn down money like that because they supposedly âare against having footballâ? I donât think so. If the money or support (i.e. support that counts and has deep pockets) is there, a football program will be backed.
[QUOTE=Normmm;140320]Just throwing out another âwhat ifâ scenario if we had started football 10 years ago. If nothing else weâd probably be in the Big East.[/QUOTE]
So are you saying theyâd throw someone out and take Charlotte or that Charlotte would get in ahead of ECU which already has a football team.
[QUOTE=MeanJoeGreen;140556]As for the budget, YEAR 2006-07 UNCC annual budget was $2,170,486,009 dollars. With previous research showing that the annual cost for a football program being about $7million (even with additional staff and womens programs), the annual cost of a football program is about[COLOR=RED] .003% [/COLOR]of the total annual budget.
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$7 million would be .32% of the budget which is 1/3 of 1% or like 1/300 of the total budget.
[QUOTE=70inchdeac;140602]So are you saying theyâd throw someone out and take Charlotte or that Charlotte would get in ahead of ECU which already has a football team.[/QUOTE]
Money is the only way we would ever hope to get into the ACC, and that isnât going to happen even if there was an opening. Youâve proved that rivalry means less than money by adding BC versus taking West Virginia or ECU. Both would have brought a ton more following to the conference, and the rivalries between the neighboring ACC schools would have only intensified.
Since we already have a Charlotte football forum, how about an anti-Charlotte Football forum where all the pessimist can post about how little our fans support our athletic program and how we could never raise enough money to fund a football team.
Thanks lutz9er for correcting my math error. Whatâs a few million dollars difference among fellow niners?
[COLOR=red]âHereâs where I really think youâre wrong. See how far the football program gets with the students paying for it. Youâll still be hoping for football 50 years from now. Students donât have deep pockets. Their parents might, but the students do not. Their attendance is a must for future success, but the students will only play a small part in offsetting the start-up costs, and thatâs only if student fees are raised to do so.â[/COLOR]
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[COLOR=black]I still say that a UNCC education is affordable. My parents didnât pay for my school. Universities are supply and demand. Duke and Wake can charge what they do for a reason. [/COLOR][COLOR=black]If it costs too much, then there are other options for people. I seriously doubt that an additional $150 bucks a semester for a football program (that most everyone wants) is going to reduce the enrollment. Call me crazy, but I think enrollment will increase. [/COLOR]
Since we already have a Charlotte football forum, how about an anti-Charlotte Football forum where all the pessimist can post about how little our fans support our athletic program and how we could never raise enough money to fund a football team.
I donât think the people arguing against football are happy to put forth reasons against having a football program, they are just stating the reasons that football probably is not coming in the near future. I think we would all like to have a team. Unfortunately, it does not always come down to what we âlike.â And I think Ktown was right about the support we get for our athletic program. We donât even fill up the seats we have when we put a good 49er team on the court. I remember when the Hornets first came and the arena was full. A couple of years later, the place was half empty. Enthusiasm will get it only so far.
But JaM, I am with you. Where there is a willâŚIf you start the ball rolling and get the necessary people to listen and to fund this project, you can count on me, whether this new Charlotte 49er football team wins or loses.