If a G5 team goes un-defeated, they should at least be in the discussion to make the playoff. Right now that is not happening.
Do I think Cincy or Coastal have a chance of beating anyone in the playoff? No, not on a normal day. Should they get the chance to pull off that upset? Yes, or at least be in the discussion for it.
I think if the AP and coaches poll did a pre-season, and then not another ranking until week 4 or 5, it would normalize the polls. There are teams that start in the top 10 and then by 3 week leave the poll for the year. I think that hurts G5 teams.
If you look at the coaches and AP poll I think they got the final rankings correct. I agree that Cincinnati should have been in the conversation. Likely deserve a chance to at least play the game. If it were 8 team this year the 3-6 match up would be Cincy-OSU and OSU wants no part of that but TV ratings would be through the roof.
I think expansion to 6 or 8 will come soon. It was a travesty this year.
The question of relative strength of Cincy this year or UCF, Boise State, or Utah in prior years always rankles me because itâs a self fulfilling prophecy.
First off, I think the strength of these teams is often underappreciated, which is the first argument anyone makes.
But the second, and more long term argument is that if you continue to block these programs from the CFP you are going to guaranty it becomes true and stays that way. As we have said ad nauseum on this and other threads, if a good player (doesnât even have to be âeliteâ - remember that Super Bowl teams are loaded with 2 and 3 star guys) thinks he can start at a program like Cincy versus having to sit at Clemson, and still have a path to the CFP, it makes a ton of difference in recruiting. If he knows his only chance to ever sniff the CFP is at Clemson or Bama or OSU, it ensures those schools will continue to have entire starting caliber teams as 2nd and 3rd stringers who are wasting years of eligibility on the bench for a chance at the CFP when they could be starting elsewhere.
That really sucks when you think about it. For both the kids and the fans. If that same 2nd string Bama RB thinks he can start at Memphis and have a legit shot to make the CFP if Memphis wins the AAC, donât you think heâd seriously consider that?
Now tell him if he goes to Memphis he may start but he can forget ever playing in any thing other than maybe the access bowl if they are lucky. I donât think you can appreciate how big of a deal that is to a young competitive kid with NC and NFL dreams.
And the sport is just so much healthier when it appeals to a broader fanbase across the USA and not just a handful of schools.
I get frustrated by this because ESPN more or less killed MLB for me by doing something like this (but not as bad) to that sport by pretending that Boston and the NYY were the only two franchises that mattered for a good decade or so.
They do this to every sport they come to dominate coverage of. They silo all the fans around a small batch of teams or a league or division so that they can maximize ad revenue and reduce costs (by not having to really cover 75 or so FBS teams - just stick them all on their ESPN+ platform where the schools essentially subsidize the production costs).
I thought the promise of cable sports was to expand coverage and interest in sports but lately it is contracting both to maximize revenue and the P5 leagues are complicit because they get rich and powerful in the process. Including a bunch of schools who are just lucky to be where they are financially.
Couldnât agree more with the baseball comparison and specifically the âRed Sox Nationâ bs they pull and I think itâs pervasive. My theory is itâs just cheaper for them to cover a limited subset of teams. How many interns do you need to staff to monitor and create highlights/narratives/etc for 130 teams vs (realistically) ~10 teams in 5 conferences. Itâs just streamlined marketing with (seemingly in their eye) little downside. ESPN strikes again.
Donât think anyone had posted this one yet⌠Apologies if I missed it. Itâs a fantastic takedown, including quotes from a bunch of industry insiders / talking heads. I was gonna post excerpts⌠But just go read it.
Unfortunately the NCAA has no power over the P5 or the CFB committee. I think a separate tournament may be the answer. I think even the threat of that will be enough to cause expansion. Youâll basically have 4 fan bases watching one tournament and the rest watching the G5.
This is the thing that is so hard for me to understand. The NCAA has so much power over eligibility and what players and coaches can and canât do but for some reason they canât run their own football championship. They do it for the FCS and every other college sport. The CFP is basically a partnership between the P5 conferences and ESPN. Itâs the only NCAA championship that is not sanctioned by the NCAA but the champion is recognized by them. They have too much power over some things but almost zero power over the CFP. They should have complete control of this and more control over the conferences to level the playing field. This gap between P5 and G5 should have never been allowed to happen. The individual media rights deals for each conference should have never been allowed to happen. In my opinion the NCAA should be the governing body for all conferences and control all championships and media revenue (similar to the nba and nfl) which should be split evenly among all members. We should all have to play by the same rules and now that just isnât happening. Sorry got a little off topic but all of this ties in to the unfair treatment if the G5.
MHH, that is a very good question you are raising, and to answer it requires delving back into history. Specifically a 1984 Supreme Court decision in the case of NCAA vs Oklahoma Board of Regents 468 U.S. 85
Itâs going to take the NCAA stepping in to make this work. $$ equals power and all of the money lies with the companies that televise sports in the US. Companies, major donors, all schools not part of the elite category with select P5 conferences, etc, just arenât going to move the needle without the NCAA stepping in and growing a pair. With Disney owning Fox Sports, ABC, ESPN, etc, there are no other major sports broadcast company that can step in and pay $$ to televise the teams not listed above, as well as support another Championship within college football, so all is doomed without the NCAA stepping up and stepping in.
Even though this is a Covid season, the point remains the same, the conference tie-ins make the bowl games even more of a farce. Tenn, S. Car and Arkansas all got invitations to bowl games simply because of their conference affiliation. Their combined overall records were 8-22.
Also to be considered is the increasing number of players opting out of bowl games because their school is not in the playoffs. If your team does not have 8 of itâs best players, what kind of conclusion can be made of the result of the bowl game. Specifically in the case of a UGA vs Cincy example. This is supposed to be an âopportunityâ for the G5 to compete against a P5 and show they belong. But it really doesnât tell you much as the P5 is more than likely going to have more players opting out than the G5.
Those are great explanations. Especially the 247 article. I knew there had been lawsuits that led to the conferences being able to manage their own media rights but I didnât realize how powerless the NCAA really is over FBS football. It sounds like 40 years ago the NCAA was trying to keep exactly what has happened from happening. It almost seems hopeless for the future & any level of parity between the P5 & G5 conferences.
Dan Wetzel calls for an expanded CFP of 8 teams with each P5 conference getting an automatic bid. The other 3 would be the best from the G5 - though he contradicts that later by mentioning at large bids.
Anyway, nice idea but just donât think the P5 would go along with a plan that would be somewhat favorable to the G5. Donât doubt that the CFP will expand eventually but it will be a de facto P5 party.
Bonagura : I think itâs time to split FBS into two divisions and go to eight-team playoff fields for both the Power 5 and Group of 5. For a long time, Iâve been a proponent of an eight-team field that includes the Power 5 champions, two at-large bids and a Group of 5 team (if it meets a certain threshold â say, undefeated with a No. 12 ranking or higher), but itâs probably just time to drop the illusion the Group of 5 is competing on a level playing field. And thatâs fine!
8 team playoff would solve a lot of issues. Thatâs likely as far as it goes. The idea above is likely as well. Not a bad solution either.
That is absolutely effing absurd, and this thinking is what the problem is. So you can put your 2 and 3 loss P5 teams up there, but the G6 has to go undefeated??? Heck no!
Itâs never going to be a fair shot until all 10 conference champs get an auto-bid to the playoff. Nothing else could possibly help, except maybe huge TV contracts to the G5 conferences, which isnât going to happen until the first thing does.
If you auto bid the 10 FBS conferences it would create a sea change towards much improved competitiveness across all of FBS football. It would not be overnight, but it would probably happen within 3-5 years (as more balanced recruiting classes accumulate). So if you wanted to do a step up plan where an auto bid was added each year (rank the G5 leagues) until all 5 had autobids, I think that would take care of the initial competition problem.
10 years later, college football would be at least as dynamic as NCAA basketball. There would be Gonzaga like programs who would rise to prominence from G5 leagues.
It would be a helluva lot more interesting than flipping a coin between Clemson Alabama and OSU every year.
Will follow up with what my preferred model is, and it is the endgame of my step up proposal above. It would still give the elite programs something extra to play for by approximating the NFL model somewhat:
12 team playoff
10 autobids, 2 at larges
Stack rank teams & seed like hoops
Top 4 get 1st round bye.
Higher ânetâ style ranking teams host round 1
Winners of round 1 play @ bye team
Semi finals and championship game as they are now, with rotating bowls.
I should try to do this with this years rankings / champions as an example.
