If we do not get them on board then they potentially will breed a variant that can infect you, possibly with worse outcomes. I’m not scared of them at all. But I do think it’s foolish to just ignore them like they couldn’t make the problem worse than it already is.
As far as living with Covid - there are very different levels of that. Living with small pocketed outbreaks of full strength virus, as well as more prevelant strains of this virus that are as weak as other existing coronaviruses are both doable. Living with current infection rates and death rates is not the endgame, and that may be where you and I can’t agree.
We havent seen enough of a downturn in infections to think we have this thing beat just yet. And a lot of the arguing and such here and especially on social media is between people who are on the “side” of thinking this thing was never a big deal at all (or I guess purely fake), those that think it’s done, and then those that dont. I just don’t see a successful outcome with such a factionalized population.
People who have been vaccinated are not the problem though. Not at all.
Beating that dead horse man. It has nothing to do with the spread of COVID. It’s all about virtue signaling. Once the need for masks go away so does the ability to virtue signal. That’s why the argument isn’t even rational. The last thing they want to happen is for their opportunity to prove how great they are to go away. So they grasp every straw they can (fully vaccinated still need to mask up ).
It’s just a different mind set. Let them do it and move on. Like you said, I couldn’t give 2 shits.
I went to Seaboard Brewery Thursday evening and met friends from work. I sat beside a lady for two hours, and then ran into her at Harris Teeter this afternoon. She said “don’t come near me”, she had just gotten a call from her 12 year old son’s school that he was in close contact last week to a kid who just tested positive for Covid. Her son will be tested tomorrow, and can’t go to school for two weeks, but who knows what that means for me? I had my second shot a week ago tomorrow, so I am not really worried, but it does remind me that maybe I am not bulletproof, even though I kind of feel that way now.
70% of ICU cases at wife’s hospital are now people under 40. Majority of cases I am aware of are like Nuggets scenario - kids / teens. Lot of sports spread. I am aware of 3 clusters from Matthew’s to Mount Airy involving kids and sports. You can fit that into whatever narrative works for your own personal bias. > Vaccines working, >kids get it and get over it easily, >kids can spread to older family members.
In both studies, the chance of infection after full vaccination was about 0.5 percent. The authors noted that the study findings are even more remarkable considering participants were likely have a higher risk of exposure than average people because they work in health care settings. What’s more, they were tested during a post-holiday surge of cases.
If you are wearing a mask because you have less than a .05% chance of contracting a virus, you’ll ha e a hard time convincing me that’s the reason you are wearing the mask.
Key paragraph. A fully vaccinated person wearing a mask is nothing more than show and has nothing to do with stopping the spread of COVID. The NY Times nonetheless. It’s theatre.
It’s true that experts believe vaccinated people should still sometimes wear a mask, partly because it’s a modest inconvenience that further reduces a tiny risk — and mostly because it contributes to a culture of mask wearing. It is the decent thing to do when most people still aren’t vaccinated. If you’re vaccinated, a mask is more of a symbol of solidarity than anything else.
And if your reason for wearing a mask is to protect others, I certainly hope you’ve stopped taking car trips as well
If you’re vaccinated, Covid presents a minuscule risk to you, and you present a minuscule Covid risk to anyone else. A car trip is a bigger threat, to you and others. About 100 Americans are likely to die in car crashes today. The new federal data suggests that either zero or one vaccinated person will die today from Covid.
Vaccines appear to reduce the chances of serious illness to extremely low levels. Someone who has been vaccinated is likely to be OK if exposed. Variants are more likely to make someone sick, but so far, the variants likely to do this have not spread widely here and what data we have suggests that mild illness is still most likely.
Vaccines appear to lower the chances of transmission, though I don’t think we have strong data on that yet, and if it’s possible for a person to get a mild case, then it’s possible for that person to spread it. Some variants may be more likely to spread in people vaccinated, so we’d really like to end this more quickly, before these or others become more common.
Right now between 19-32% have had a full course of vaccination depending on which state you’re in (Georgia appears to be the worst), meaning most people have not been vaccinated yet. We are still in the midst of the pandemic even if everyone is tired of dealing with it. Until we have stronger data that vaccinated people don’t spread the virus, it’s worth it to take minimal precautions to deal with it when in settings where spread is more likely (especially indoors, in large groups, in situations where spread is greater like working out or singing). It’s not just virtue signaling, it’s still about caring about others.
We also have the problem of mandating precautions for some people and not others with zero way to tell them apart (particularly since some people seem to hate the idea of vaccine passports too).
From the beginning of this pandemic, there have been a group of people that have argued against the seriousness of it, the need for taking precautions both large and small, and the safety of the vaccines (not always the same people in each group). For all the complaints above about people who have sensationalized the risk, the opposite is also true, there are people that have continuously downplayed the risk. As a whole, it’s hurt our ability to end this quicker.
This car crash comparison assumes everyone is vaccinated, thus its misleading. The number of vaccinated people that die is not the right number to consider when a majority of the population is not fully vaccinated. I wonder if the author of that knew this and decided to make a dishonest analogy anyway, or if they just made a mistake in how they presented the argument.
Brad Keselowski says he hasn’t decided yet whether to get vaccinated against COVID-19 while Austin Dillion and reigning NASCAR Cup Series champion Chase Elliott say it’s a personal choice and no one else’s business,
I got my first shot on Sunday and wife is getting hers this week. TBH, the main reason we got it is because we are hoping to fly south this winter and I don’t see that being allowed without proof of vaccination. I have a feeling most countries, or at least the one we will go to, will require it.
Johnny ain’t wearing a mask so I ain’t either. Jimmy, Johnny has gotten his shot but you ain’t done it. Don’t care if he don’t half to I don’t neither.
It says if you have been fully vaccinated you are at a minuscule risk of getting COVID or giving it to some one else. You are no longer a factor in the spread of COVID. You have a greater chance of dying in or killing someone in an auto accident.
The rollout has slowed tremendously because the carrot for getting a relatively untested vaccine was full liberation. That carrot was pulled quickly when people like Fauci came out and said you still need to wear a mask and stay away from large groups even after being vaccinated. That is just not true. It’s theatre and nothing more. Now they can’t understand why people are hesitant to get vaccinated.
The response to this pandemic started out with total incompetence and is ending with lies and misinformation. Not a great combination
I’ve been fully vaccinated. All the info I have read says I’m no longer a threat to the spread of COVID. I will act accordingly. Any mask wearing would be done in the name of theatre and passing out warms and fuzzies to all those around me. I’m not in the mood currently.
[quote=“MullinsManiac, post:320, topic:35273”]
It says if you have been fully vaccinated you are at a minuscule risk of getting COVID or giving it to some one else. You are no longer a factor in the spread of COVID.
[/quote] The first part of your statement is well-supported. The claim about giving it to someone else is not (yet) and is the reason that the CDC says the science is unclear on the point of whether vaccinated people can still spread the disease. It’s almost certainly a lower rate of transmission and the early evidence points this way, but in situations where other factors mean transmission risk is higher, it may still be a high enough chance to make minimal precautions worth it. We don’t know yet, so it’s not just theatre to be cautious about it.
Still doesn’t deal with the other issue of being unable to tell who is vaccinated and who isn’t. I’m sure no one would ever lie about their status to be able to attend a large gathering…
I’m not sure what you mean. If you are not fully vaccinated and chose not to wear a mask that’s on you. I’m not advocating for that.
If I’m fully vaccinated I’m not a factor in the spread of COVID even to those not vaccinated. I’m not going to catch it or spread it. So no need to wear a mask.
If I am asked to wear the mask I will. Otherwise I am not. It isn’t that big a deal to me to wear it, but it is also mostly pointless. My wife had it, I didn’t get it. Never tested positive after 3 tests. I am doubly vaccinated. I am not the problem with this pandemic at this point, others are. I can’t control other people and their health is not my responsibility at this point. The vaccine is readily available. I did not adopt this line of thinking until once the vaccine was available to all. At this point each person can make their own decision. Everyone in my circle has been vaccinated - so at this point I will go about my normal life, indoors, crowds, whatever.
And to MM point I think one of the biggest road blocks in getting more folks vaccinated is that even once you are we still have these rules - which prompts the why get vaccinated line of thinking.
I disagree that we know you won’t spread the virus (need more studies on this point to make a stronger conclusion). Even if additional studies find greater support, the risky behavior of the unvaccinated is not just on them (we’ve discussed this above already), so we need a way to determine who is vaccinated or not, or accept that we can’t regulate who wears a mask in potential super-spreader events and suffer the consequences of that. I think that’s a mistake.
You could make an argument that the best way to get more folks vaccinated is dropping the mask requirement and the crowd sizes and let people get sick for not being vaccinated. We are still operating under this ideal that it’s still my job to stop you from getting sick - even when there is a free easy to access step that would reduce that chance to nearly nothing. What we need to put it back on the individual. Make it clear the threat exists and those of us who have taken the necessary steps are going back to life and if you haven’t you are putting yourself in a situation of potential exposure and society is no longer setting itself up to protect you from your own stupidity. It sounds harsh but I am past the point of trying to talk sense to people.
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